June 4

No reason to argue. Please read the peking duck blog post.
48 000 demonstrating people in Hongkong, 17 000 according to the police.
Waiyim was there.

Image (from Wikipedia) is Execution painted by Yue Minjun


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6 responses to “June 4

  1. Aprilsnow

    It's a topic I can comment a lot, what should I say? ask questions or make statement? I read the whole article on the PekingDuck blog, well, his description of what Chinese said about the event is very true. So, why the understanding is so different? 1) Media report.2) Can democracy and freedom serve as food? Russia had democracy and freedom after the collapse of Soviet but many starved to death.3) Despite all the arguments of Peking Duck and its alike, have they ever been prepared to be a Chinese and live as a Chinese? do they ever worry about China falling apart? Then you will see the difference…

  2. pfelelep

    Hello Aprilsnow, I was expecting you ^^Actually, I think the whole answers and questions thing will come from chinese people. As a foreiger, I can only observe. (and as a French, I cannot stop criticise others (especially other countries), just like birds cannot stop singing :rolleyes:, that's french style, unfortunately).I just want to report what I've heard in the restaurant I've just been this afternoon, the cook said:"democraty is something you cannot do at home, but you urge your neighbours to do".

  3. anonymous

    Four four writes:

    I would like to add my comment after I saw the message of Aprilsnow.I'm chinese too. I agree what she said. Me too, I don't want my country into the chaos. I just want to ask some questions.I heard many chinese critics said, if we killed 20,000 people in that 4 June movement & we can have 20 years peaceful & development in future, that's worth for China.May I ask, if you or I or my family, should I want to be killed by Chinese government to exchange the rich lives of the others, or the rich lives of corrupt ministers?Our government or national medias try to said that, behind the moment 4 June, there're the power of American or other countries. Maybe. I don't know. Because "4 June" is always mysterious & forbidden to talk. Even there're many many secrets behind the government that they must to stopped that "riot". Is that the only way : KILLED PEOPLE & STUDENTS THAT THEY HAD NO WEAPONS. And they just wanted to express themselves and anti corruption of government. (even today, there're always problems of corruption in China.)If my richness is exchanged by blood, is it worth?

  4. Aprilsnow

    @Philippe, expecting me? That's interesting. Of course, you French are the loudest critics out there, look at your president, but so far among my Opera friends French are the most friendly ones, so don't ruin your reputation yet ;). It's perfectly all right for foreigners to say whatever they like, after all, a lot have been said for many years, in fact, I am quite familiar with what they say. What I pointed out in my last comment was why there is such a difference. Eastern culture has never been based on absolute individual freedom, we have to compare effects on individual and on the entire country as whole, nation's interest or the whole people's interest is always above individual's, this is basic Confucius teaching. Also, I want to point out that here I am not judging what way to put down the demonstration is the best, that's a different issue.The cook's statement is certainly interesting, "democraty is something you cannot do at home, but you urge your neighbours to do". Maybe we can replace "democracy" with "chaos"? OK, seriously speaking, Chinese want democracy but it will take our own way and pace. @anonymousI don't think I will follow your way of arguments. I don't like to argue with an anonymous person who would use other people's mouth to state unsubstantiated death number. I am only interested in sincere idea exchanges. If you want to talk, please use your account and make sure each and every statement you make can be examed and verified.

  5. Liu

    Très fort le dessin Pfe !!!

  6. Aprilsnow

    Once again, it's the time that many remember about this tragic event. We all see the picture of this tank man, but how many of you have seen pictures below:Protesters with Picture of Mao ZedongImage: © Peter TurnleyPhotographer: Peter TurnleyDate Photographed: May 18,1989Location Information: Beijing, ChinaDemonstrators Protesting in Tiananmen SquareDemonstrators hold up pictures of Mao Zedong during a protest in Beijing's Tiananmen Square. In the spring of 1989, students and citizens held massive pro-democracy demonstrations in Beijing, China, which culminated in the government declaring martial law and a violent clash between protesters and the People's Liberation Army.Image: © Jacques LangevinPhotographer: Jacques LangevinDate Photographed: May 20, 1989Location Information: Beijing, ChinaDemonstrators holding Primier Zhou Enlai's picture.1989.4.27, the slogans included: "Long live democracy, long live People", "Long live the integrity of Chinese CCP", "Firmly insisting on socialism" etc.If we put all these pictures together with the tank man, how would people interpret them? So what's the real purpose(s) of the students? Is the media giving a full picture to you? The media has repeatedly claimed "thousands of students" were killed, and the above "anonymous" even used the number 20,000, where are the evidence of so many killed? A rights group organized by the mothers of the students who died said on their web page — the number they could confirm is 156. It's a very tragic event, however, it's even more tragic that there are those media that deliberately misinterprets and misleads people.

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